Did any of the many public figures who commented yesterday on the resignation of Kathleen McMahon as governor of the Dochas Centre in Mountjoy say anything about her comments on overcrowding causing an increase in lesbianism in the prison?
Ms McMahon said the regime within the centre had been designed to treat women with dignity and respect aimed at their successful reintegration into society.
However, the centre was now so overcrowded, the progressive regime was being cannibalised.
“I would say it probably would go back to the way it was years ago: self-mutilation, bullying, depression, lesbianism.�?
Relationships between women in prisons happen all over the world and not just in soap operas. And the number of women in prison, sharing cells or not doesn’t seem to have effect. It still happens. Women seek relationships, companionship, friendship because they are lonely or exploring their sexuality or have nothing else to do. They may not seek to remain in relationships with women once they leave prison and no matter how terrible the conditions are in Dochas I don’t think citing lesbianism as a resulting problem is going to worry the prison service officials. There are certainly lesbians in prison – ie. women who were lesbian before they were committed.
Referring to lesbianism in the same breath as self-mutilation, bullying and depression indicates to me that Ms McMahon has no understanding of human sexuality no matter how long she has worked in her position.
Reform of the penal system and a reflection on why women end up in prison for crimes that men would not be sentenced for would be timely, as well as examination and action on the mental health, addiction problems and exploitation of women outside the prison system that lands them inside at all.
Mary Rogan reflects further and far more calmly on the wider issues involved in a post on Human Rights in Ireland Blog
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What a dumb libtard you are. These women are the scum of society,murders, thieves and general incorrigable degenerates.Prison must, in a civilised society be a place of punishment, not a flop house, else there is no real deterrant. We should take our model from the American penal system, an efficent and right minded regime.
These inmates should not have private showers and rooms with piped tv and appetising food and enjoy free association. They should be locked up in single cells for 22 hours with 1 hour for excerise and another to empty their piss pots and shower and some association, as for diet, unsweetened porridge is plenty good.
Why are men locked up for most of the day and forced to slop out? This is clearly a case of gender discrimination, yet none of the sisters are complaining, maybe their too dumb and immoral to see the truth. BTW, wtf do you mean by “crimes that men would not be sentenced for” Would men not be gaoled for murder, assault, persistent theft, drug smuggling, for fuck sake,get a grip, grow a brain or else shut the fuck up you stupid cunt.
Well, Fintan’s obviously managed to learn the big boy words in your 3am tirade, but still needs that course in anger management along with some understanding of crime and punishment policy in Ireland. What is degeneracy, is it when you call someone a “stupid cunt” in a blog? Your fantasy of how a women’s prison should function illustrates a great deal about your misogynistic view of the world. Quand on est doué, c’est pour la vie!
I didn’t spot the commentary about lesbians, and I’m puzzled that someone in her profession seems unaware of situational same-sex relationships.
Like Homosexuality in men’s prisons, it is not always consensual. Not always rape, but sometimes a grey area which people can regret getting involved in.
Argumentum ad hominem is no substitute for a well constructed and reasoned thesis. Sadly Fintan Stack employs the former.
Mamam is quite right in pointing out that the juxtaposition of lesbianism with self-mutilation, bullying and depression by Kathleen McMahon is a blind spot in an otherwise reputedly decent ex women’s prison governor.
Am really surprised by her comments as she seemed like a decent sort. I visited the prison a few years ago and in spite of the somewhat ‘progressive’ conditions, it was still a place of detention. Most of the women we met were poor and in there on drug-related crimes.
O yeah and @Fintan, go away.
Ah Fintan, Fintan, Fintan. Where to start with your foul-mouthed rant. Actually, I won’t bother. Describing the US penal system as “right-minded” undermines you more than I ever could. Keep practicing the joined up writing though!
As for Ms. McMahon’s comments: No-one in the mainstream meeja has pulled her up on it and it’s certainly a dumb statement for a clearly very bright woman to make.
By her logic, all the Irish prison service needs to do is put the gay men and women in the Irish penal system in cells together and “Hey-Presto!” they’re straight! End of ‘problem’…
Has decreasing “lesbianism” been one of the goals since there is a fear overcrowding will cause previous levels of same? I couldn’t believe it yesterday when reading about the resignation that she seemed to a) see relationships formed between women in prison (as Maman has posted here) as ills akin to bullying, depression and self-mutilation and b) not to acknowledge that some prisoners are lesbians and not caused to be such by their living conditions while imprisoned. At first I thought it must be a misquote but now I’m wondering if it was on the list of things to be prevented/rehabilitated?
I’m just reeling from the fact that I went the whole day yesterday reading and listening to reports about her resignation and didn’t once spot this!!
Thanks be to Zeus you wrote about this Mama, I thought I was seeing things when I first read her quote in article and on the front page of the Irish Times too!Such an awful pity that she said something so offensive in her bid to take a stand against the conditions in the Dochas centre. Couldn’t believe the ignorance of it! Very incongrous in terms of her espousal of human rights, equality and progression.
Ps the charming Fintan should really grow a brain.
Fintan Stack very amusing. US prisons are precisely an example of how not to run prisons. Ultimately they are as much revolving doors as Irish ones, one of course to which you, as a US taxpayer, will find yourself handsomely rewarding private multinational profiteers for. They simply serve as a very expensive way to effectively temporarily house law-breakers who get caught – but of course its all wonderful and ok since some shareholder or private millionaire somewhere in the neoconservative regime makes a profit out of it.
The prison system in western society is supposed to act as a deterent to committing crime in the first place. However its clear that it doesn’t make any impact at all. Given that it has a zero success rate its not unrealistic to feel it needs reassessment. As a businesswoman if an initiative I had taken had a 100% failure rate I’d be inclined to review it and look at feasible alternatives. From what I can see of the Irish system, it seems to be in many cases a convenient alternative to long term care for a large minority with chronic mental health and addiction problems. That is not what it was intended for.
Anyway Maman’s key point is one I agree with – adding “lesbianism” to the list of prison pathologies reinforces the stereotypical Victorian notion that sex-between-women is yet another quaint vice. This is also reinforced in many representations of lesbians in media circles such as predator, murder, prostitute etc. While there is a huge effort to portrary successful businesswomen in the media as strong, feminine, independent, etc, you rarely if ever see open lesbians in these representations outside of the US – yet from my own experience I see in Ireland that gay women in business are disproportionately successful and if anything overrepresented, but highly closeted. It reinforces the idea of “lesbian” as depraved woman rather than simply “woman.”
An outrageous homophobic remark from someone who should know better. And while it seems there are wider problems in the women’s prison, her departure is certainly no loss.
As for the charming Fintan, I think Madam was right to resist the temptation to delete his obnoxious comment. These people do more to discredit themselves and their “cause�? through their rantings than any response from a reasonably minded person.
Thanks Maman for drawing everyone’s attenttion to this unbeliveable comment by Ms McMahon. The juxtaposition of lesbianism with self-mutilation, bullying and depression by Ms McMahon is so awful and just shows the lingering attitudes still out there